(with whom BROWNING, TRASK, J. BLAINE ANDERSON and TANG, Circuit Judges, concur):
Upon a vote of a majority of the judges, pursuant to Fed.R.App.P. 35(a), the court en banc has taken the question whether a defendant, who elected not to testify during his trial, could preserve on appeal his challenge to the trial judge’s ruling on a motion for an order excluding evidence of his former robbery convictions.
The trial court ruled in advance of trial that if Cook chose to testify the government could impeach him with evidence of any of his prior convictions not time-barred by Fed.R.Evid. 609(b).4 Cook elected to remain silent, but now asserts that the chilling effect of the court’s preliminary ruling changed the course of his trial and prejudiced his defense. He says that the court denied him an important opportunity to place his own testimony before the jury and, in so doing, misapplied Rule 609(a).
Two lines of authority have developed in this circuit on the preliminary question of appellate review for defendants who elected not to testify. Compare United States v. Murray, 492 F.2d 178 (9th Cir. 1973), cert. denied, 419 U.S. 854, 95 S.Ct. 98, 42 L.Ed.2d 87 (1974), with United States v. Brashier, 548 F.2d 1315 (9th Cir. 1976), cert. denied, 429 U.S. 1111, 97 S.Ct. 1149, 51 L.Ed.2d 565 (1977).
In Murray and our cases which cite it, we have said that one who does not testify cannot complain on appeal about impeachment by prior convictions that might have been revealed if he had testified. See, e. g., United States v. Fulton, 549 F.2d 1325, 1327 (9th Cir. 1977). See also United States v. Walters, All F.2d 386 (9th Cir.), cert. denied, 414 U.S. 1007, 94 S.Ct. 368, 38 L.Ed.2d 245 (1973).
From time to time, however, without citing Murray or Walters, we have also proceeded to examine on their merits trial court rulings requested under Fed.R.Evid. 609. In United States v. Brashier, supra, although the defendants did not testify, we considered the admissibility of the evidence of prior convictions and held that they would have been admissible. Earlier, in United States v. Villegas, 487 F.2d 882 (9th Cir. 1973), we considered, and rejected, a pre-Rule 609 motion to exclude evidence of convictions that had little or no direct bearing upon truth and veracity.
Now that Rule 609 has been in effect for more than three years, and trial courts are ruling daily upon motions brought under that rule to exclude evidence of prior convictions, we believe it is unrealistic to continue to refuse to review these rulings unless the defendant takes the stand. The effect of the preliminary ruling can substantially change the course of the trial, and any ruling which so changes the course of a trial ought to be subject to judicial review.
Defendants and their counsel make many tactical choices during a trial. Ordinarily, these choices are binding upon the defendant. However, assuming only for the purpose of argument that the trial court erred in announcing its application of Rule 609, the error may cause a defendant to make a choice5 that he might otherwise not have *1184made.6 The government must admit that the tactical choice to remain silent is more likely a product of the court’s ruling than of the defendant’s free selection among strategic options.
It pushes the doctrine of waiver beyond its usual criminal-law application to say that a defendant responding to an erroneous ruling by the trial court by remaining silent has waived his right to testify. And waiver becomes even less convincing if we say that by remaining silent under the constraints of an erroneous ruling on a point of law the defendant has waived his right to challenge that ruling on appeal.
It is argued that precedent commands respect, a point hardly to be debated; and it is further argued that respect for precedent requires us to deny appellate review unless the defendant takes the stand and is in fact impeached by the erroneous use of his prior convictions. The difficulty with this argument is that the precedent upon which it depends grew out of the common-law rule that proof of any felony, no matter how remote in time or how tenuously related to truthfulness, could be submitted to the jury for the jury’s consideration in passing upon the credibility of every witness, including defendants who elected to testify. The rule that any felony can be used for impeachment had been under attack by the academic community for several years before the courts began to move toward the legislation now codified in Rule 609. See, e. g., Luck v. United States, 121 U.S.App.D.C. 151, 348 F.2d 763 (1965), and discussion rejecting the Luck rule in the Ninth Circuit in United States v. Villegas, 487 F.2d at 883.
While the so-called Luck rule was specifically repudiated by Congress (for the District of Columbia) in 1969, and rejected by a majority of the federal and state courts called upon to respond to it, Congress now has settled the question. In 1975, Congress adopted the new Federal Rules of Evidence, including Rule 609. This case does not call upon us to explore the outer limits of rule 609, but it is unlikely that Congress would have enacted such a controversial change in the law of evidence unless it also intended to permit defendants to appeal questions presented by the new rule.
On the narrow question presently before us, the appealability of a preliminary ruling which the defendant says kept him from the stand, pre-Rule 609 precedent really sheds no light. For example, United States v. Webster, 522 F.2d 384 (8th Cir. 1975), frequently cited for the proposition that a defendant has no constitutional right to testify without fear of impeachment, is good authority, particularly in the Eighth Circuit, on the constitutional question, but the case says nothing about the appellate remedies of a defendant who claims to have been prejudiced by an erroneous ruling on Fed.R. Evid. 609.
Our own cases are equally obscure in their application to judicial review under the new rule. In Shorter v. United States, 412 F.2d 428 (9th Cir.), cert. denied, 396 *1185U.S. 970, 90 S.Ct. 454, 24 L.Ed.2d 436 (1969), the defendant inquired about the use of his former convictions and when told that they ■ could be used, elected to tell the jury himself, on direct examination, in an attempt to lessen the impact. We held that by telling about his former convictions he waived his opportunity to object to them and thus did not preserve the issue for appeal. 412 F.2d at 431. In Murray the defendant decided not to testify after the court refused to rule on the validity of several convictions, on the ground that the motion, which came two and a half weeks into the trial, was too late. In affirming, we agreed with this ground and also, extending Shorter’s reasoning, found a waiver in the defendant’s failure to testify.
In both Shorter and Murray the trial court never actually ruled on the admissibility of the convictions. In Shorter it simply gave an advisory opinion about what its ruling would probably be if the question were presented, while in Murray the only adequate request for a ruling came too late to be considered.7 That is not the situation here, and it is unlikely to be the situation again.
Before the adoption of Fed.R.Evid. 609 it was uncertain whether a trial judge had discretion to exclude evidence of prior convictions on the ground that they were unduly prejudicial. Shorter v. United States, 412 F.2d at 430-32. Thus the court’s duty to rule and the proper time and manner for counsel to request a ruling were both unclear. The result was that in neither Shorter nor Murray did this court have an actual ruling which it could review; accordingly, both defendants’ claims were necessarily speculative.
The adoption of Rule 609 has changed the situation, for it requires the trial court to weigh the probative value of the impeaching conviction against its prejudice to the defendant,8 except for a narrow category of recent convictions directly involving dishonesty or false statement.9 Our holding in Murray that a request for a ruling on the validity of prior convictions may be too late if it is made during the trial should encourage counsel to make the motion early in order to obtain pretrial rulings.
A provisional ruling does not necessarily evade appellate review, merely because the party ruled against adjusts his trial strate*1186gy to meet it. The Supreme Court recently reached out, according to the dissenters, to decide on the merits whether a state court had correctly applied a federal constitutional principle in announcing a preliminary ruling, the effect of which was to dissuade a defendant from testifying. New Jersey v. Portash, 450 U.S. 440, 99 S.Ct. 1292, 59 L.Ed.2d 501 (1979). Because the case turned upon a state’s treatment of a constitutional question rather than upon the kind of statutory question we have here, we recognize that Portash may not compel the result we reach here; but by analogy Por-tash reinforces our conclusion that Cook did not, by remaining off the stand, forfeit the right to have the point reviewed on appeal.10
There is no need in this case to decide when, during the pretrial proceedings or the trial, a motion in limine should be made, or when it should be ruled upon. The matter should be left to the discretion of the trial court with a reminder that advance planning helps both parties and the court. Trial by ambush may produce good anecdotes for lawyers to exchange at bar conventions, but tends to be counterproductive in terms of judicial economy. Other courts considering the problem have recommended a provisional ruling in advance of proposed testimony, with the judge free to meet any deception by modifying the ruling. See, e. g., United States v. Oakes, 565 F.2d 170 (1st Cir. 1977).
Motions in limine have proven their value in litigation. They save jury time, and avoid the waste that sometimes results from haste when side-bar matters have to be urged in the course of the trial. To persist in holding that rulings made in advance of trial are unreviewable unnecessarily discourages the use of such motions. In future cases, the court and counsel confronting Rule 609 problems should turn to Fed.R.Evid. 103 for guidance.
Rule 103 restates the common-law rule that a party seeking reversal upon the basis of an evidentiary ruling must show that a substantial right has been affected. The rule provides for offer of proof, hearing outside the presence of the jury, and the making of a record.
In the case at bar, the appellant did not make an offer of proof, and thus the record on appeal is less than satisfactory. The court, also, might have made a clearer record on the balancing it was required to undertake in its ruling. We have construed the record in this case, however, in favor of appellate review because we realize that the use of Rule 609 was relatively new at the time of trial. Moreover, the rules had not been augmented by extensive procedural discussion in the courts or in the rules themselves.11
In future cases, to preserve the issue for review, a defendant must at least, by a statement of his attorney: (1) establish on the record that he will in fact take the stand and testify if his challenged prior convictions are excluded; and (2) sufficiently outline the nature of his testimony so that the trial court, and the reviewing court, can do the necessary balancing contemplated in Rule 609. The trial court can then articulate its reasons for ruling as it does in each case. In future cases, a defendant who does not make the record contemplated in Rule 103 can fairly be said to have abandoned the point, and, accordingly, the teaching of the pre-Rule 609 cases in this circuit still has some value.
*1187On the merits, the trial court stated that, on the facts of this case, the robbery convictions the government intended to use had probative value which outweighed the prejudicial effect of the evidence upon the defendant. On reviewing the record, we cannot say this ruling was an abuse of discretion. See United States v. Langston, 576 F.2d 1138 (5th Cir. 1978).
From earlier colloquy about witnesses, the court had reason to believe the defendant would take the stand and palm himself off as a peace-loving member of the American Friends Service Committee with interest in prison reform and social protest. In the context of the entire record, it is not surprising that the court was unwilling to let a man with a substantial criminal history misrepresent himself to the jury, with the government forced to sit silently by, looking at a criminal record which, if made known, would give the jury a more comprehensive view of the trustworthiness of the defendant as a witness. See United States v. Alvarez-Lopez, 559 F.2d 1155 (9th Cir. 1977).
Normally the court should err on the side of excluding a challenged prior conviction, with a warning to the defendant that any misrepresentation of his background on the stand will lead to admission of the conviction for impeachment purposes. See e. g., United States v. Jackson, 405 F.Supp. 938 (E.D.N.Y.1975). But in rare cases the court’s suspicions may be adequately grounded in the prior course of the trial to permit an advance ruling that the accused’s record will shed probative light on the testimony the accused has indicated he will offer. On studying the record, we cannot say that this is not such a case.
We do not hold that all crimes of violence against persons and property are always relevant for impeachment so long as they are not time-barred. Indeed, other circuits have held that Rule 609(a) precludes such a rule. See, e. g., United States v. Smith, 179 U.S.App.D.C. 162, 551 F.2d 348 (1976). But, on the record of this case, we are satisfied that the trial judge neither abused his discretion nor prejudicially misapplied Rule 609(a) as written.
In United States v. Dixon, 547 F.2d 1079 (9th Cir. 1976), we held that it was error to exclude (at the prosecution’s behest) evidence of a prior conviction of robbery where the court had mistakenly excluded it on the ground of remoteness in time. Fed. R.Evid. 609(b). We noted that it could have been excluded under Rule 609(aXl) only if the court made a preliminary finding that the prejudicial effect to the defendant outweighed the probative value of the evidence of conviction. There, the defendant was seeking to use the conviction to impeach a government witness and was in no position to claim prejudice.
A good deal of scholarly debate illuminates the use of prior convictions for impeachment. When the prior conviction involved a crime more of violence than of deception, there must be a balancing of values under Rule 609. Congress apparently intended to allow crimes of violence to retain some impeaching effect in some cases. Otherwise, the reference to the death penalty would be meaningless. See, e. g., United States v. Oakes, supra. The rule also goes on to make it clear that convictions of crimes of deception are always provable, regardless of penalty, unless time-barred. Other serious crimes remain in the area of judicial discretion. The majority of this court at this time sees no need to explore all the hypothetical questions that can be propounded under Rule 609.
In conclusion, on the point taken en banc, we hold that the categorical rule of United States v. Murray, supra, which denies appellate review unless the defendant testifies and is impeached, is no longer the law. Moreover, having reached the merits of the trial judge’s preliminary ruling, we find that his balancing of the respective values contemplated in Rule 609 at best was inarticulate, and at worst revealed that he misconceived the purpose of the rule. However, the ruling did not constitute an abuse of discretion, as appropriate reasons could have been given for it. The decision to permit the prior convictions to come in was not, therefore, the kind of error that re*1188quires reversal under Fed.R.Evid. 103. The defendant had a fair trial, and no useful purpose would be served by another trial merely to enable the trial court to express its decision in language suggested by the commentators on Rule 609.
None of the asserted errors in this case amounts to a reversible error.
Affirmed.
. Fed.R.Evid. 609 provides in pertinent part:
“(a) General rule. For the purposes of attacking the credibility of a witness, evidence that he has been convicted of a crime shall be admitted if elicited from him or established by public record during cross-examination but only if the crime (1) was punishable by death or imprisonment in excess of one year under the law under which he was convicted, and the court determines that the probative value of admitting this evidence outweighs its prejudicial effect to the defendant, or (2) involved dishonesty or false statement, regardless of the punishment.
“(b) Time limit. Evidence of a conviction under this rule is not admissible if a period of more than ten years has elapsed * * *.”
. The ruling apparently had that effect in this case. During pretrial conference, the following *1184exchange took place between Cook’s attorney and the district judge:
“MR. CZEISLER: Your Honor, I made several months ago a motion in limine concerning Mr. Cook’s prior convictions so I would be able to know ahead of time whether or not I would be putting my client on.
“THE COURT: So you could made a decision as to whether to put him on the stand or not.
“MR. CZEISLER: Yes.
* * * * * *
“THE COURT: All right, let me consider that, and I will let you know again tomorrow. I will get word to you tomorrow so you will know well in advance and can make your decision as to whether you want to put your client on or not.”
. One can never say with certainty that a specific defendant would have taken the stand even if evidence about prior convictions were excluded. Trial lawyers can moot that point to no final answer, but the House Subcommittee notes, and the full Committee thought it safe to say, that more defendants will testify if prior convictions are kept from the jury than if the prior convictions are to be revealed. See House Subcommittee on Criminal Justice Notes; Report of the House Committee on the Judiciary; and Additional Views of Hon. Lawrence J. Hogan, quoted in S. Salzburg & K. Redden, Federal Rules of Evidence Manual 336-42 (2d ed. 1977).
. This distinction does not explain our cases perfectly. In United States v. Villegas, 487 F.2d 882 (9th Cir. 1973), we reviewed a judge’s refusal to rule, while in United States v. Fulton, 549 F.2d 1325 (9th Cir. 1977), we refused to review a definitive ruling. Villegas was decided before United States v. Murray, 492 F.2d 178 (9th Cir. 1973), while Fulton was decided after the effective date of Fed.R.Evid. 609. Neither considered the new rule’s impact on our previous position. In a situation identical to that presented here, the First Circuit has rejected Fulton and Murray. The court concluded that a defendant who chose not to take the stand in reaction to the trial judge’s advance ruling under Rule 609 may challenge the ruling on appeal. United States v. Hickey, 596 F.2d 1082 (1st Cir. 1979).
. Judge Bauer, in an early case dealing with the effect of Rule 609, has provided guidelines to assist district judges confronted with a request for a ruling. See United States v. Mahone, 537 F.2d 922, 929 (7th Cir. 1976). After pointing out that the legislative history of Rule 609 places the burden on the government to establish admissibility of prior convictions, Judge Bauer outlines briefly a format for the hearing. The factors which the trial court should consider in exercising judicial discretion antedate Rule 609. Some factors that were mentioned by then Judge Burger as early as 1967 are these:
“(1) The impeachment value of the prior crime.
(2) The point in time of the conviction and the witness’ subsequent history.
(3) The similarity between the past crime and the charged crime.
(4) The importance of the defendant’s testimony.
(5) The centrality of the credibility issue.” United States v. Mahone, 537 F.2d at 929, citing Gordon v. United States, 127 U.S.App.D.C. 343, 383 F.2d 936, 940 (1967).
. See, e. g., United States v. Ortega, 561 F.2d 803, 806 (9th Cir. 1977). It was held error,to impeach with a misdemeanor shoplifting conviction because, for impeachment under Rule 609, a misdemeanor must have been one involving “dishonesty or false statement”. While reasonable minds may differ about the honesty of a shoplifter, our court has followed the legislative history of Rule 609 and read “dishonesty” in pari materia with perjury, false swearing, false pretense, and the like.
. See also, United States v. Brown, 501 F.2d 146 (9th Cir. 1974). The trial judge said that an impeachment witness could not testify unless afterwards he turned over copies of documents on which his testimony was to be based to the government. Rather than submit to this condition, defense counsel chose to forego impeachment. This court did not discuss appealability but held that “conditioning impeachment with prosecutorial discovery was prejudicial error.” 501 F.2d at 151.
. A comprehensive treatment of Rule 609, with legislative history and comments based upon local experience under the former law may be found in Judge McGowan’s scholarly opinion in United States v. Smith, 179 U.S.App.D.C. 162, at 170, 551 F.2d 348, at 356 et seq. (1976).