¶ 95. {concurring). The majority opinion is scholarly, but it fails to recite a number of key facts that provide context and perspective to the constitutional issues before the court. This concurrence will set out those additional facts and then explain why the defendant forfeited the right to assert a violation of his public trial right long after his conviction and sentence.
I
¶ 96. On Saturday, November 23, 2002, approximately 50 persons of Albanian descent gathered at the Albanian Community Center in South Milwaukee to celebrate the birthday of a young child. Most, if not all, of the persons in attendance were related to each other by blood or marriage. The child's birthday presented the opportunity for a family party. The party was held several days before the annual celebration of Albania's independence (November 28) and shortly before the defendant, Dhosi Ndina- — one of the five sons of Stefani Ndina (the family matriarch) — was scheduled to fly *704back to Albania. The party was festive, with music, dancing, and ample food and drink, including alcoholic beverages.1
¶ 97. Sometime after midnight, a dispute broke out among the children of Ilia Ndina and Robert Janko. This skirmish prompted an argument between the two fathers.
¶ 98. Erjon Dhembi, then 22, knew the two men well. One, Ilia Ndina, was his uncle. Ilia was the brother of Erjon's mother, Konstandina. She, in turn, was a daughter of Stefani Ndina. The other father, Robert Janko, was Erjon's cousin. As the argument proceeded, Erjon got up from the table where he had been seated for dinner and urged the two men to calm down and respect the atmosphere of the family gathering. With peace apparently restored, the three men returned to their seats.
¶ 99. Ilia Ndina was seated at a table on one side of the community center near his brother Dhosi, who was visiting from Albania. Moments later, the two men approached Erjon Dhembi from behind. Ilia Ndina "tapped" Erjon on the right shoulder and threatened to kill him. Immediately thereafter, Dhosi Ndina stabbed *705Erjon in tlie neck with a steak knife and then stabbed him again in the back. Bleeding heavily, Erjon stood up and began walking to seek medical attention, but he quickly stumbled and then fell. He was assisted by his father, Spiro Dhembi, two uncles, Ardian and Llazi Ndina, and his sister Eglantina Dhembi. His family rushed Erjon to St. Luke's South Shore Hospital in Cudahy. He was then transported by helicopter to Froedtert Memorial Lutheran Hospital where he underwent emergency surgery.2
¶ 100. Erjon's father, Spiro, was incensed by the attack on his son. He and Eglantina went to the South Milwaukee Police Department to report the incident before they learned that Erjon's condition required that he be transferred to another hospital.
¶ 101. Acting on the information the Dhembis had supplied to the South Milwaukee police, the Milwaukee County District Attorney's office issued a criminal complaint against Dhosi Ndina and obtained a warrant for his arrest. The complaint was filed and the warrant obtained on Sunday, the 24th of November. Authorities acted quickly in an effort to arrest Dhosi before he could catch a scheduled flight to Albania.
¶ 102. Although he spoke little or no English, Dhosi was somehow able to elude capture and fly home. He was apprehended in Albania months later, on August 13, 2003, and remained in custody there until he was extradited to the United States on April 21, 2004.
*706¶ 103. When Dhosi was returned to Milwaukee, his family hired a prominent criminal lawyer, James E. Kachelski, to represent him on a charge of attempted intentional homicide. Sixteen members of the family attended the preliminary hearing. When Kachelski later persuaded the court to reduce Dhosi's bond from $100,000 to $50,000, Dhosi's family pooled their resources to put up the cash. Dhosi was then placed on in-house monitoring and required to live with his mother who is also the victim's grandmother. Other members of the Ndina family lived in the same duplex.
¶ 104. The fact that the defendant was confined to the home of the victim's grandmother undermined the court's release condition that the defendant have no contact with the victim's family. In effect, the victim's family and the defendant's family so overlapped that they were not readily distinguishable.
¶ 105. On April 29, 2005, Attorney Kachelski filed the defendant's witness list for trial. It contained the names of 13 family members. The State's witness list included four additional family members.
¶ 106. On May 5, Kachelski filed motions on sequestration of witnesses and introduction of witnesses. The sequestration motion asked that "all witnesses for the prosecution or the defense be excluded from the courtroom, including during voir dire, and that all witnesses be admonished not to discuss their proposed testimony or completed testimony with any other witness during the pendency of this trial." Another motion requested that "no distinction be drawn during voir dire between possible prosecution and defense witnesses, and that the court introduce all witnesses as possible witnesses, and not as prosecution or defense witnesses." The court ultimately entered a sequestration order that *707effectively barred 17 family members, including the victim, from the courtroom except when they were testifying.
¶ 107. In his opening statement, Attorney Kachelski told the jury that "there's going to be quite a few witnesses, and these witnesses have different vantage points, different biases, different family alliances .... I think it would be unnatural if family members didn't talk about this incident. And memories can start to fade over time . . . ." (Emphasis added.) Attorney Kachelski continued, "[TJhings will become important when you analyze what the witnesses say, analyze their vantage point, their motives, consider what they're saying, their biases, their family allegiances." (Emphasis added.)
¶ 108. Kachelski's statements, whatever their intent, revealed the divisions and conflicting loyalties that had developed in the family as a result of Erjon's stabbing and Dhosi's prosecution. These divisions were frequently confirmed in subsequent testimony.
¶ 109. Dhosi's trial began on May 9, 2005, with voir dire and the selection of a jury. On May 11, during testimony of the State's third witness, Spiro Dhembi, the court briefly stopped the proceeding. The transcript reads as follows:
Q So let me be clear. You're saying that Ilia got up, walked over and punched Erjon?
A Yes.
Q And then it was minutes later that Dhosi came up and stabbed him?
A Yes.
Q And —
THE COURT: One moment. One moment.
BY MR. ZIER:
*708Q How was it you were able to see —
THE COURT: One moment. Tim?
THE BAILIFF: I hope they speak English.
THE COURT: Ms. Hysi, I'm going to have you go out with my deputy.
(Discussion off the record.)
THE COURT: You may continue.
¶ 110. After the jury was released for the evening, the court made the following record of what had transpired:
I was also, from my point of observation up here on the bench which is higher than all of the other places in the courtroom, able to see individual family members in the gallery who were also engaging in a level of conversation that not only the Court could hear, but I feared that the jury could hear as well.
We stopped the proceedings or I stopped the proceedings and directed my deputy along with interpreter Vera Hysi to communicate to those members in the gallery — those family members in the gallery that they must remain silent and not talk among each other while they are in the courtroom.
I observed my deputy and Miss Hysi go into the gallery and communicate that order and directive from the Court. Thereafter it appears that the — my order has been followed. I have not seen or heard anything from those family members in the gallery since that directive was made.
In addition, however, the Court noted that as Mr. Spiro Dhembi was becoming more emotional, agitated on the witness stand, the Court also observed the defendant begin to respond. Both of them were speaking in their native tongue, Albanian. The Court did not *709know what they were saying although they were speaking, and it was clear to the Court that it wasn't in response to any particular question that had been put to the witness.
I directed both the witness, Mr. Dhembi, and the defendant, Mr. Ndina[,] that they are not to talk or converse unless a question has been put to them directly.
¶ 111. The facts above were known to the court and to counsel before the incident the following day in which the court excluded family members (except Stefani Ndina) from the courtroom. See majority op., ¶¶ 13-14. These facts presented extraordinary circumstances to the circuit court — circumstances that cannot be separated from the legal issues now under review.
II
¶ 112. Dhosi Ndina's trial lasted 10 days. The jury returned its verdict at 10:15 a.m. on May 20, the tenth day.
¶ 113. The majority opinion describes, in ¶¶ 14-17, the events near the end of the fourth day of trial when the court issued its order excluding all family members from the courtroom.
¶ 114. "As an exception to its order, the circuit court permitted the defendant's mother to remain in the courtroom." Majority op., ¶ 16. The defendant attacks the significance of this exception, contending that his mother did not speak English at the time of the trial. This may be true, but the record reveals that Stefani Ndina was a naturalized U.S. citizen whose father had been a U.S. citizen.
¶ 115. In any event, the courtroom was closed to other members of the family on Friday, May 13; Monday, May 16; and Tuesday, May 17. Excluded persons missed *710part of the lengthy testimony of Spiro Dhembi; the testimony of State witnesses Francis Rotter, David Hoeppner, Brian Fleming, and Peter Jaske, all South Milwaukee police officers; the testimony of defense witnesses Ardian Ndina, Bledian Ndina, Mimoza Ikonomi, Vasilika Proko, Kastriot Fekollari, and Egriselda Fekollari; and the testimony of rebuttal witnesses Spiro Dhembi, Eglantina Dhembi, and Francis Rotter. Family members returned to the courtroom on May 18 through May 20 for jury instructions, closing arguments, jury deliberations, and the verdict.
¶ 116. In sum, a few persons not otherwise excluded because of their status as listed potential witnesses missed three days of the trial because of the court's order. They missed the testimony of four police officers, none of whom witnessed the crime; six defense witnesses; some testimony from Spiro Dhembi; and rebuttal testimony from Spiro and Eglantina Dhembi, most of whose testimony had been fully open, and Francis Rotter.
¶ 117. Attorney Richard Kaiser, who skillfully represented Dhosi Ndina in post-sentencing proceedings, produced sworn affidavits from Vladimir Ndina, Lola Ndina, and Femi Ikonomi, indicating that they would have attended the trial, or more of the trial, had they not been excluded by the court's order. In his own affidavit, Attorney Kaiser added that three other persons, Buie Spathiu, Mosko Proko, and Maksut Spathiu, had wanted to attend the trial and that Enkeleda Ndina had been removed from the courtroom.
¶ 118. These seven persons require analysis. First, the defendant filed three affidavits, not seven.3 *711Second, all seven persons may have been present at the Albanian Community Center on November 23-24, 2002, and if they were, they could have been listed as witnesses or called as rebuttal witnesses. Third, Vladimir Ndina, the defendant's brother, was indisputably present at the Albanian Community Center. Lola Ndina is married to one of Dhosi's brothers (not Ilia) and was very likely at the Albanian Community Center, as Ardian, Llazi, and Vladimir Ndina, the remaining brothers, were all present. Femi Ikonomi is the father-in-law of Mimoza Ikonomi, the defendant's sister and a defense witness. Mosko Proko is the father-in-law of Vasilika Proko, another of the defendant's sisters and a defense witness. Like Lola Ndina, Enkeleda Ndina was married to one of the defendant's brothers (not Ilia, who was married to Flora). Maksut and Buie Spathiu are apparently related to the defendant by marriage. Even under the most ideal circumstances, the court would have been hard pressed to draw meaningful distinctions among these people, a number of whom were not present when the ruling was made.
¶ 119. In addition, the court did not prohibit friends of the defendant who were not family members from attending the trial. Moreover, the court never closed the courtroom to news media or the public at large,4 and it acted explicitly to protect a sequestration order requested by the defendant.
¶ 120. Thus, it is beyond belief to suppose that the circuit court's decision on May 12, 2005, to temporarily exclude family members from the courtroom, amounted to the kind of "structural error" in the judicial process *712that would warrant a new trial, especially in the absence of even a murmur of protest from the defendant or the defendant's counsel.
Ill
¶ 121. Although I agree with the majority's affirmation of the court of appeals' decision, I am troubled by the majority's unwillingness to make a forfeiture determination one way or the other, thereby necessitating an elaborate, not always persuasive analysis of whether the circuit court's order excluding family members from three days of trial violated the defendant's Sixth Amendment right to a public trial. In my view, the defendant forfeited the right to assert a violation of his public trial right when he failed to make a timely objection — an objection that would have permitted the court to modify its order if needed and address any legitimate concerns.
¶ 122. As a general rule, a constitutional error does not automatically require reversal of a conviction. Arizona v. Fulminante, 499 U.S. 279, 306 (1991) (opinion of Chief Justice Rehnquist) (citing Chapman v. California, 386 U.S. 18 (1967)). However, "there are some constitutional rights so basic to a fair trial that their infraction can never be treated as harmless error." Chapman, 386 U.S. at 23, n.8 (citing Gideon v. Wainwright, 372 U.S. 335 (1963) (right to counsel); Payne v. Arkansas, 356 U.S. 560 (1958) (coerced confessions); and Turney v. Ohio, 273 U.S. 510 (1927) (right to an impartial judge)).
¶ 123. In Fulminante, the Supreme Court explained that the "common thread" connecting cases in which a harmless error analysis may be applied is that "each involved a 'trial error' — error which occurred *713during the prosecution of the case to the jury, and which may therefore be quantitatively assessed in the context of other evidence presented in order to determine whether its admission was harmless beyond a reasonable doubt." Fulminante, 499 U.S. at 307-08. The Court thereupon changed the rule on admission of an involuntary confession — "a classic 'trial error'" — because it deemed admission of this evidence as "markedly different from the other two constitutional violations" referred to in Chapman, e.g., total deprivation of the right to counsel and trial before "a judge who was not impartial." Id. at 309. "These," the court stated, "are structural defects in the constitution of the trial mechanism, which defy analysis by 'harmless-error' standards." Id. (emphasis added). "The entire conduct of the trial from beginning to end is obviously affected by the absence of counsel for a criminal defendant, just as it is by the presence on the bench of a judge who is not impartial." Id. at 309-10.
¶ 124. The Court then noted that "other cases [since Chapman] have added to the category of constitutional errors which are not subject to harmless error." Id. at 310 (citing Vasquez v. Hillery, 474 U.S. 254 (1986) (the unlawful exclusion of members of the defendant's race from a grand jury); Waller v. Georgia, 467 U.S. 39 (1984) (the "right to public trial"); and McKaskle v. Wiggins, 465 U.S. 168 (1984) (the right to self-representation at trial)). "Each of these constitutional deprivations is a similar structural defect affecting the framework within which the trial proceeds, rather than simply an error in the trial process itself." Id. (emphasis added).5
*714¶ 125. In Neder v. United States, 527 U.S. 1 (1999), the Court observed that "we have found an error to be 'structural,' and thus subject to automatic reversal, only in a 'very limited class of cases.'" Id. at 8 (quoting Johnson v. United States, 520 U.S. 461, 468-69 (1997)).
¶ 126. The Court has said that structural errors "infect the entire trial process," Brecht v. Abrahamson, 507 U.S. 619, 630 (1993), and "necessarily render a trial fundamentally unfair," Rose v. Clark, 478 U.S. 570, 577 (1986). These errors deprive defendants of basic protections without which "a criminal trial cannot reliably serve its function as a vehicle for determination of guilt or innocence." Id. at 577-78.
¶ 127. The Court also has said, however, that the determination of a structural error may rest "upon the difficulty of assessing the effect of the error." United States v. Gonzalez-Lopez, 548 U.S. 140, 149 n.4 (2006). Writing for a majority of the Court, Justice Scalia said that fundamental fairness is not the sole criterion of structural error. Id. He pointed to Waller as an example of a case in which "difficulty of assessment" heavily influenced the "structural error" categorization by the Court. Id.
¶ 128. The Gonzalez-Lopez decision appears to signal a shift in the Court's rationale for structural error, from an error that is so clear and fundamental *715that evaluation is unnecessary to an error for which evaluation is speculative or impossible.
¶ 129. In any event, the inclusion of Waller in the list of cases exposing "structural error" is problematic. It is true that "the benefits of the public trial are frequently intangible, difficult to prove, or a matter of chance." Waller, 467 U.S. at 49 n.9. Hence, violation of the right satisfies some of the rationale for setting aside the harmless error standard.
¶ 130. However, Waller itself stated that "the Court has made clear that the right to an open trial may give way in certain cases to other rights or interests, such as the defendant's right to a fair trial or the government's interest in inhibiting disclosure of sensitive information." Id. at 45. In other words, there are certain cases in which a court is able to justify closing a trial to the public. Cf. Walton v. Briley, 361 F.3d 431, 433 (7th Cir. 2004) ("[WJhile criminal trials that are not open to the public are strongly disfavored, they are not forbidden.").
¶ 131. The indefinite nature of the public trial right is further complicated by the broad array of situations in which a criminal trial may be temporarily closed, or closed to some people but not all people.
¶ 132. The difficulty in assessing whether a defendant's public trial right has been violated counters the difficulty in assessing the effect of a violation upon the defendant. This is surely one reason why Waller indicated that violation of the right to a public trial is not subject to "automatic reversal" in the same way as violation of certain other rights. Waller's case was remanded to the trial court for a suppression hearing after the Court determined that a violation had occurred. Waller, 467 U.S. at 49-50.
*716¶ 133. The Waller Court agreed with the proposition that "the defendant should not be required to prove specific prejudice in order to obtain relief for a violation of the public-trial guarantee." Id. However, it asserted that the relief "should be appropriate to the violation." Id. at 50. The Court did not refer to "structural error" in the opinion, because that term did not come along until later. Although it quoted from a dissenting opinion of Justice William Brennan, Levine v. United States, 362 U.S. 610, 627 n.* (1960) (Brennan, J., dissenting) ("[T]he settled rule of the federal courts [is] that a showing of prejudice is not necessary for reversal of a conviction not had in public proceedings."), the unanimous Waller Court did not adopt a rule of "automatic reversal" of conviction for every violation of the public trial right.
¶ 134. To sum up, Waller does not fit well into the structural error category if "structural defects always lead to automatic reversal." Gonzalez-Lopez, 548 U.S. at 159 (Alito, J., dissenting) (citing Fulminante, 499 U.S. at 306-10); cf. Sullivan v. Louisiana, 508 U.S. 275, 279 (1993) ("Some [constitutional errors] will always invalidate the conviction.").
¶ 135. Categorizing the violation of the Sixth Amendment right to a public trial as structural error does not relieve a defendant of the obligation to enter a timely objection to a violation of the right unless the defendant is not in a position to do so.
¶ 136. Normally, a defendant asserting violation of a constitutional right must object at the time of the violation or forfeit the right to raise the issue later. In United States v. Olano, 507 U.S. 725 (1993), the Court declared that" 'No procedural principle is more familiar to this Court than that a constitutional right. . . may be forfeited in criminal as well as civil cases by the failure *717to make timely assertion of the right before a tribunal having jurisdiction to determine it.1" Id. at 731 (quoting Yakus v. United States, 321 U.S. 414, 444 (1944)).
¶ 137. The court of appeals relied upon this principle to avoid a full-blown analysis of Dhosi Ndina's constitutional right to a public trial, and it turned instead to the question of whether the defendant had been denied effective assistance of counsel. Our challenge is to determine whether the court of appeals made the correct call.
¶ 138. It must be noted that defendant Waller objected to closing the suppression hearing that was held prior to his trial. Waller, 467 U.S. at 40. This objection unquestionably helped his case. The Court said: "[W]e hold that under the Sixth Amendment any closure of a suppression hearing [to the public] over the objections of the accused must meet the tests set out in Press-Enterprise [Co. v. Superior Court of California, 464 U.S. 501, 510 (1984),] and its predecessors." Id. at 47 (emphasis added).6 The Court also distinguished Waller's position from that of another defendant, Cole, stating:
Counsel for petitioners Waller, Thompson, Eula Burke, and W.B. Burke lodged an objection to closing the hearing. Counsel for petitioner Cole concurred in the prosecutor's motion to close the suppression hearing. *718Respondent argues that Cole is [now] precluded from challenging the closure .... Cole's claims in this Court are identical to those of the others. Since the cases must be remanded, we remand Cole's case as well. The state courts may determine on remand whether Cole is procedurally barred from seeking relief as a matter of state law.
Id. at 42 n.2 (citations omitted) (emphasis added).
¶ 139. The "matter of state law" to which the Court referred is the state law on forfeiture.
¶ 140. No doubt there are situations in which the forfeiture rule does not apply because the defendant is not in a position to make a timely objection. For instance, in Walton, the prosecution's entire case against Walton was held in the late evening hours after the courthouse had been closed and locked for the night. Walton, 361 F.3d at 432. Walton did not object, but he may not have realized at the time that the courthouse had been locked. Id. Likewise, in State v. Vanness, 2007 WI App 195, 304 Wis. 2d 692, 738 N.W.2d 154, the defendant did not object to closing the courthouse during his trial because the doors were locked before he realized what had happened. Id., ¶¶ 2-3. Vanness did promptly move for a mistrial when he learned what had happened. Id., ¶ 3.
¶ 141. The line of cases in which a defendant is not in a position to make an objection to a closed or partially closed trial does not apply here. To my mind, it would be difficult to concoct a clearer example of forfeiture than this defendant's failure to register a timely objection to the court's order. The defendant was fully aware of the circumstances: he was forewarned of the court's concerns on May 11; he observed first-hand the court's decision to exclude family members on May 12; and he was present when the court revisited the *719issue on May 13. The only plausible explanation for the defendant's silence is the manifest reasonableness of the court's order under the circumstances.
¶ 142. In most of the Supreme Court cases identifying or discussing structural error, the defendant, like Waller, timely asserted his rights or timely lodged an objection. See Gonzalez-Lopez, 548 U.S. at 140; Neder, 527 U.S. at 6; Brecht, 507 U.S. at 625; Fulminante, 499 U.S. at 283; Vasquez, 474 U.S. at 256; McKaskle, 465 U.S. at 168; Gideon, 372 U.S. at 337; Payne, 356 U.S. at 561. In some cases, the presence or absence of a timely objection was not discussed. See Sullivan, 508 U.S. at 275; Rose, 478 U.S. at 570. The Supreme Court has not become indifferent to the importance of making timely objections.
IV
¶ 143. This case presents the challenge of reconciling the protection of an important Sixth Amendment right with the necessity of requiring the key players in a criminal proceeding to conduct themselves in a manner that promotes and preserves the orderly administration of justice. Timely objections are vital to the orderly administration of justice. A party's failure to make a timely objection ought to entail a cost to the party unless the failure is justified by the circumstances, or the judiciary is required to vindicate a higher value. If a deficient party is rewarded for its lack of diligence, it will not be diligent.
¶ 144. This defendant was required to object to the exclusion of family members from the courtroom at the time they were excluded inasmuch as he (and his experienced counsel) knew exactly what was happening and why. He was not entitled to remain silent in the *720face of the court's order and then raise a constitutional objection many months after he was convicted and sentenced.
¶ 145. A defendant who fails to object still may argue that his counsel provided ineffective assistance. A defendant also may invoke the plain error doctrine that was discussed last term in State v. Jorgensen, 2008 WI 60, ¶ 23, 310 Wis. 2d 138, 754 N.W.2d 77 ("If the defendant shows that his unobjected to error is fundamental, obvious, and substantial, the burden then shifts to the State to show the error was harmless."). Cf. Johnson, 520 U.S. at 461; Olano, 507 U.S. at 725; State v. Mayo, 2007 WI 78, 301 Wis. 2d 642, 734 N.W.2d 115. Both options put the initial burden on the defendant so that he is not rewarded for failing to make a timely objection.
¶ 146. For the reasons stated, I respectfully concur.
¶ 147. I am authorized to state that Justice ANNETTE KINGSLAND ZIEGLER and Justice MICHAEL J. GABLEMAN join this concurrence.Albanian family bonds are especially strong. It is not uncommon for generations of a family to work together in a family-run business. Many extended families live together and care for each other. Often adult children live with their parents, or several generations live under the same roof....
Family events, such as engagement parties and weddings, are important social events in the Albanian community. . . .
Preparing and sharing food are central to Albanian family life.
Megan Brody, Albania and Albanians in the United States (2003), http://www2.bc.edu/~brisk/albania.htm (last visited Feb. 23, 2009) (emphasis added).
The victim's sister, Eglantina, testified that after the stabbing she "actually" put her finger in the back of Erjon's neck trying to stop the bleeding. The victim himself testified: "I lost a quarter of my lungs... and part of my rib." In all, Erjon Dhembi suffered a severed artery and a collapsed lung and was hospitalized for a week.
The fact is that Attorney Kaiser prepared eight affidavits to support his motion, but only three of them were filed.
The court noted the presence of a school group in the courtroom early in the trial.
Other cases can be added to the list of constitutional errors not subject to harmless error analysis: United States v. *714Gonzalez-Lopez, 548 U.S. 140, 150 (2006) (erroneous denial of the right to counsel of choice); Sullivan v. Louisiana, 508 U.S. 275, 277-82 (1993) (deficient reasonable doubt instruction); Gomez v. United States, 490 U.S. 858, 876 (1989) (voir dire and jury selection before a magistrate who lacks jurisdiction); and Price v. Georgia, 398 U.S. 323, 331 (1970) (second prosecution for the same offense after conviction of lesser-included offense is reversed).
The presumption of openness may be overcome only by an overriding interest based on findings that closure is essential to preserve higher values and is narrowly tailored to serve that interest. The interest is to be articulated along with findings specific enough that a reviewing court can determine whether the closure order was properly entered.
Press-Enter. Co. v. Superior Court of California, 464 U.S. 501, 510 (1984).